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  #21  
Old 01-16-2019, 07:16 PM
nomics nomics is offline
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I think the rule "Gods" are pissing off more people than not. Seems like they are just making a handful of SMG guys happy cause they apparently think they just talked or bought their way into a National Championship. This political rules crap has always been a thorn in the side of SCCA. It happens in most all clubs but SCCA seems to screw it up the worst. I know sooo many people that left this club because if this very crap. If these SMG cars stay in AS they should at least have to disable ABS and lose the wing IMO.
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Last edited by nomics; 01-16-2019 at 08:23 PM. Reason: Used a bad word
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  #22  
Old 01-17-2019, 08:35 AM
Rotaryracer Rotaryracer is offline
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I'm not in favor of adding SMG as currently spec'd, and have sent a letter to the board this morning stating as much. If enough AS drivers send letters today to BoD@scca.com, I have to expect it would be discussed since they're all together at the National convention.

I offered the following suggestions to resolve in my letter:
  • Reverse the decision and move SMG back to T2
  • Remove the "SMG-specific" bits and convert the car to current AS spec. These are largely bolt-on parts, so we're not talking major rework here.
  • Immediately address the balance of performance issue by adding weight, removing aero aids, and mandating AS-sized wheels to limit grip
I'm as or more concerned about the way this large of a rule change was handled as I am about the performance discrepancy. Did I miss a WDYT or a solicitation for feedback from the CRB or ASAC about adding SMG, or was this just a unilateral decision and shoved down our throats?
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  #23  
Old 01-17-2019, 12:00 PM
Ted Johnson Ted Johnson is offline
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Default Smg rule

(1) No modifications to the engine are allowed except where specifically authorized
within these rules. RACE-BUILT ENGINES ARE NOT ALLOWED. All engines will
be as built and delivered by Ford Motor Company.
(2) Cars in this class are to run stock 4.6 liter engines from 2005-2009 cars at no
more than 315 rear wheel horsepower, and 325 ft lbs of torque. Updating or
backdating of entire engine long block is allowed.
(3) Dyno testing may be required if it appears than an engine in a competing car
has an edge in power. Determination of any potential power advantage will be
made by SCCA stewards. Test to be done at owner’s expense by dyno shop

The Dyno rule needs to be more specific about what Dyno, and specifics on how it is setup for consistency. Better find out the closest Dyno to VIR, if anyone wants to protest at the runoffs.
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  #24  
Old 01-17-2019, 12:55 PM
PamRichardson PamRichardson is offline
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Default Some answers

Ted -- Agreed......

Rotary -- I have received guidance that all letters should go directly to the BOD on this. You are correct. Also, you did not miss a request for feedback on this change. Correct again.

Matt -- As Scott noted, during the previous two attempts to have SMG join AS, the request was made to the SMG people to disconnect ABS and remove their wing. They refused. Just a note from the 2017 Runoffs. A racer brought a former SMG car to Indy. I talked to him prior to his trek. I recommended he look at the AS rules to determine what he needed to change to make that car AS compliant. Tech caught that his front splitter was not compliant at the track....

If you don't want this change, you will need to send letters (see above).

Pam
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  #25  
Old 01-17-2019, 02:04 PM
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DBailey DBailey is offline
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Default Fix and support--

When I heard of this I immediately sent a unpleasant letter to our director on the BOD. I haven't heard from him at all. I have never been in favor of this kind of a change --wasn't in 2013 and not now.

I do understand what may be the rationale for this---that AS is dying and these guys can help the numbers----the same rationale as in 2013.

If we were to assume that we could get the BOD to overturn this, or at least allow the ASAC to adjust the specs on the SMG cars, will the rest of the AS community participate and bring up the numbers?? Call you friends in AS, Send your letters and do something to show SCCA that there is still support for the class.

There are many AS cars sitting, nationwide, unused in AS. Why aren't they out racing?? Yes we have heard all the reasons and excuses before, from "too expensive" to "un-competitive". I can admit that Aaron and I are among those that have left, although until last month I still had an AS Car to race. Those involved for a while in AS will understand why we left, --but until this allowance of SMG into AS we were going to come back into the class, we were offered a car to drive and were starting to make plans--
When this SMG inclusion came about I bailed on the idea, and as it turns out all the other AS racers i've talked to on the west coast are equally disgusted.

Many on this forum are former AS racers, not happy with what's going on, yet how many are actually doing anything to promote or save the class??
Other classes in Prod. and GT have has similar issues with car counts and rallied the guys to get out and participate to get the numbers up.

So quit whining and dust your car off and get on track!
Send your letters, bombard the BOD with insight,and if you care about the class then get out and race.

The class can be fixed, with full prep and limited prep cars just all being AS cars---it will take some unselfish attitudes, new realizations, and group support. This can be done, has been done (prod classes), and should be done.

--off to work I go---
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  #26  
Old 01-17-2019, 02:18 PM
kbsmith1 kbsmith1 is offline
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Here is what I sent to bod:

Dear Board of Directors,

I am very disappointed in SCCA for its recent change to classify the SMG cars into American Sedan. These cars have since 2014 tried to get into AS without
any changes. As run, all their on-track performance data has shown that they are easily 1-2 seconds per lap faster than national championship winning AS
prepped cars. As a West Coast American Sedan owner and driver, I feel that you have instantly made my car completely uncompetitive against any SMG
that chooses to show up for Super Tour or Majors races.

For years, American Sedan has disallowed front splitters, rear spoilers, Anti-lock barking systems, and wheels wider than 8”. Now this new car is brought in
that allows all those things, plus massive changes to suspension, with a starting build price of approxiamtely $40000. And all this is done in a seemingly back door
deal without any input from American Sedan competitors.

I would like to see SMG immediately removed from American Sedan classification. I feel that the SCCA rule making process was not followed in making this decision,
and that therefore the decision should be rescinded. I will spend my racing dollars elsewhere if SCCA continues to cater to special interests like this.

Sincerely,
Kevin Smith
Member # 249608_1
Oregon Region American Sedan owner and driver since 2000
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  #27  
Old 01-18-2019, 10:49 AM
Ken Felice Ken Felice is offline
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Thumbs up Smg /as

All you AS guys don't let this SMG thing worry you to much. With enough letters it can be corrected. The runoffs will be on this side of country next 2 years, how many Smg cars will show up? we only have a few true AS cars that show up from the California, and it is always the same guys thank you. Look at the number that was entered at Sonoma. We had more AS cars from MI. than from California. that has to tell you something about national racing and reg. racing ,Keep your AS cars the class is still the best class out there and the changes that have been done for RP cars to be in the class that will get more cars in. If it costs 40,000. plus car to build a smg car, I think you could buy a very good AS car for less money.
Pam thank you for all you have done for class and the scca. Hope you are on the mend it takes time I had by pass surg. in 2015 been great sense.
Thank you for the time.
Ken Felice
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  #28  
Old 01-18-2019, 10:55 AM
Ted Warning Ted Warning is offline
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Default SMG rule change

I too have written a letter to the BoD, complaining about this sudden, back door change. I have been supporting ASedan by campaigning one of the few iron head cars out there anymore despite being told by the ASAC to toss my motor and build a aluminum head motor.

Now this. Its too much.

I also have a LP Camaro and a T4 Camaro. Will fit in my new garage but would rather sell at least 2 of them. PM me if interested. Will be priced to sell.
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  #29  
Old 01-18-2019, 12:21 PM
nomics nomics is offline
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I submitted my letter. Thanks to those who shared their letters. Mine was pretty much the same. I was looking at SCCA.com and the explanation of the rules process and step 1 is member input. I just feel that this one was totally ignored in this case. It is so discouraging to see these things happen. I have written a good amount of letters in the last 2 years compared to the previous 8 years I've been in AS. I didn't agree with some weight adjustments and complained a lot but I bolted the weight in and made some races. The changes in personel on the board and ASAC is making me nervous. If I felt that this was something a majority of AS people agreed with I would take it better I guess but it seems like we got blind sided and they don't care.
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  #30  
Old 01-18-2019, 04:38 PM
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wre46 wre46 is offline
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OK, I don't have a dog in this fight anymore but SMG is not the problem. If anything it will add a few cars for car count. From what I have seen SCCA is not good at making competition adjustments. You guys keep saying there are many cars parked, its because it is not cheap to run the class IF you want to run up front. We have seen many cases of folks cheating over the years and the guys that don't cheat feel it is easier to just park their cars. If someone wants the list of know guys who have been busted, send me a PM and I guarantee you will not like what you read. I quit when non-post specs got me excluded from the Runoffs.

It's not just AC that is experiencing car count issues. To crown a National Champion with less than 7 cars in a class...wow. It used to be hard to earn an invite to the National Championships, now you just show up , take the green and you show up. The 110% rule is not enforced, so you don't see great racing like the old days. MOV of 30 plus seconds is not racing.

Since I am in bitch mode lets see what else is SCCA doing to turn away people.

No GCR's, outrageous entry fees, no race coverage in SPORTSCAR, One and out for the Runoffs (local Hotels must love this). I tried to find results from the Homestead race and found a BIG FAT ZERO COVERAGE! People will say its a South Florida issue (heard this many times) It's an easy fix, don't give them a Major anymore.

FYI guys, its not just the car count is down, its also the workers. The Majors was a neat idea on paper and I loved the two race weekends as it did cut down on cost, but again, the entry fees kill are killer.


I was actually considering trying to borrow a car for the 2020 Runoffs but from what I have seen in the last few months I think it would be a waste of time. Maybe I'll borrow a SMG Mustang and qualify it at a bunch or Regionals.

I wish I had a solution, b ut SCCA need to learn about the first rule of holes....Once your in one....STOP DIGGING!

Jeff Werth
Former AS driver
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