View Full Version : Edelbrock Heads Debut at Sebring in P1

08-30-2008, 05:37 PM
The #34 Pro Systems/Felice Engines A/Sedan Mustang debuted the New Edelbrock Cylinder heads with a Pole Position on a wet track and only 2 seconds a lap off the Sebring Track Record.

While other competitors were traveling 3-5 seconds a lap slower than their normal time.

After getting approval from our competitors to run them and assistance from Edelbrock, we installed them as delivered direct from the Edelbrock factory.

We did no port matching etc...right out of the box only shimming the springs a little to our desired spring pressure.

The throttle response is incredible and the graphing from the data acquisition shows a very wide usable rpm band.

After adding the appropriate weight to the vehicle we took the #34 Pro Systems Mustang out for our qualifying effort. A sudden rain halted qualifying momentarily so despite dodging puddles (some were unavoidable expecially under the bridge at the treacherous Turn 17...actually the concrete was dark brown and wet throughout turn 17). Yet we were able to run a 2.28.2 second lap only 2 seconds off the track record set on a dry track in cooler January weather.

All in all...very pleased with the performance of these heads as delivered from Edelbrock. They outperformed our GT40 heads by a good margin.

Thanks to everyone at Edelbrock/Ken Felice/Andy McDermid and especially my crewchief Brad Hosmer for getting these heads installed just in time.

Patrick James

08-30-2008, 11:04 PM
Would you be wiling to share that data with a fellow Mustanger? I'm curious to see the numbers and graphs and such.

08-31-2008, 10:12 AM
The results were.
1) I need more rear grip
2) I need more rear grip
3) I need to find out why the car keeps pushing out the RR axle seal (the resulting "oiling" might be contributing to the rear grip issue)
4) I need more rear grip

My first competitive Sebring excursion wasn't a total disaster. Other than the car wanting to step the rear out going in or coming off the ANY turn, Sebring is amazing. For those who haven't raced it..it is a rough track. But what do expect for a 70 year old WWII bomber base?

My first omen was my brand new starter taking a :censored: (broke the mounting flange) on the tech scales before I ever took the track. A quick trip to Autozone during lunch for a replacement cured that, after pulling the header of course. BTW, I was 20#under with 3/4 tank of fuel. More weight coming soon.

Hurricane Gustavs's outer feeder bands soaked the already precarious turn 17 just prior to qualifying. I hooked up with Bill Eberline Jr. on the back straight before 17 and we did our impression of synchronized sliding all the way through it. (That was fun) Unfortunately for me, studying track maps is a poor substitute for driving the track. I was TOTALLY lost on the back section, never getting into any consistent rhythm through the multiple turns. I thought the motor was performing well (after a post-practice valve lash adjustment) until Patrick blew my doors off coming off of turn 10. Whew!! :eek: Then for reasons unknown, the oil pressure dropped to about 40 psi @ 6500 for half a lap, so I shut it down for the weekend. That may be a lingering result of my 350+ degree oil temperatures @ Homestead DS. Oil temp was not an issue at Sebring. So, after a mind-numbing 3:05 best lap as a "drifting" competitor, and considering the oil pressure, axle seal, and handling issues, I packed it up and headed back home. At least my newly redesigned panhard bar and third link brackets were rock solid.

AS far as Patrick, we met for the first time. He is as cocky and brash in person as he is on this site. I loved it. We hit it off right away!!!:thumbsup:

I'm gonna pull the motor for an inspection, get a softer rear swaybar, and figure out what-in-the-:censored: is going on with the :censored: axle seals. The remaining 2 AS competitors are Bill and Bill Jr (sharing one car) and Patrick. Although with the weather forecast, I wonder if they'll get either race in today. Hopefully....

Despite it all, I had a blast.

thomas toth
08-31-2008, 01:31 PM
Wow.....think of what the heads will do for the GM cars!

#38 Camaro

thomas toth
09-01-2008, 01:56 PM
Question....you said you used the heads "out of the box" , did you calculate the compression ratio? From what I understand the Chevy heads will need to be milled a bunch if you run a 302. Not sure if it is the same deal or not for the Fords. It would be interesting if the car ran that good with a lower CR.

#38 Camaro

Dawson Motorsports
09-02-2008, 09:42 AM
Well Patrick, I guess the heads worked pretty good for you. I'm glad you contacted your competetion to see if they would give you any flack about running the heads.
Of course you relaize they aren't legal until 11/01/08!
Didn't you protest someone at Daytona for not having the proper stickers on his car and called him a cheater, because he must have had at least 600hp. But no one could prove it or pony up the protest fee to tear down his motor.
In the past you have stated, you are testing carb's for all these roundy round guys or nascar stuff. How many times has your car with all these wins at a regional level, been in compliance?
And buy the way, are those traction bars hanging down under your car?

09-02-2008, 11:12 AM
C'mon don't sully my name. Our camp has always been open. The hood is always popped. Everyone came over and looked at stuff and asked questions regularly. I would show my data acquisition numbers, GPS and lateral traction overlays etc...I'd tell you my gear ratios, preferred racing lines, spark plug heat ranges, timing etc.. what worked and what didn't. you could see my in car video etc...it was great fun.

Ask any of the guys we race with: You can come up and crawl under our car (many did), help us adjust the valve lash, ask us what shock settings or springs we run and we'll even swap out carbs with you.

We run an honest operation.

I always showed up to tech even at the regional races (I was unaware until yesterday that there was no tech at the regional level) I always thought it was random and so you were always supposed to drive there. I drove right up there both Saturday and Sunday and was turned away after qualifying and after my drive in the rain.

It was a good drive on relatively new tires for me (c'mon ...the drag racer can drive a little can't he?).

You can reread the other post about Daytona, the facts are there. No SARRC decals on the next day really clinched that deal.

They said the engine pumps were inaccurate, so I offered to pump my engine first to "test" the pump for the guy. They didn't take me up on the offer either. I would've ponied up the $250.00 though. But the tech guy said the $25.00 decal protest would do the job. The driver said he wouldn't be there the next day so that was that. He lied again and was there the next day and Sean Ryan got ripped off by him.

As far as carb testing goes, all our testing was done during practice in the morning, you can take the best carb and only pick up 5-10 h.p. over our A/sedan carbs. But you sure give up a lot of driveability as these engines like small non Winston cup carbs. We did run a 2 barrel one time. Some fun, still pretty quick though. Like I said, theres only about 5-10 h.p. in carbs with these engines.

If they are traction bars...they are made of plastic. Its a brake duct Chuck, it's legal I called and e mailed several folks before I did it. Yeesh.

Anyway, I'm gonna take A/Sedan off my favorites so I can get out of this loop as it'll draw me back in and make me wanna race.

Our business is expanding and we're opening a new shop (twice as big as our current one) for expanding our Manufacturing and R and D operations. So I have to focus on that next year...then I hope to get back into road racing again as I had fun racing with my guys.

Thanks Mitchell Geltz, The Evelands, Scott Seifreit, Sean Ryan, Matt Germino, Donnie Ingold, Bruce Reichard and Mark "The Marine" Walther (thats your new nickname...put it on your car Mark).

I loved racing with you guys. You're good people.


Patrick James

Mitchell Geltz
09-03-2008, 02:10 AM
PRO SYSTEMS................... Wins at Barber. Lets Roll

Sean #40
09-03-2008, 06:27 PM
Well lets not bicker guys Both Chuck and Patrick have helped me and i thank them both. Patrick was the logic choice for testing the heads he is fast.
Regardless of stickers or ilegal engines we were the last group at Daytona and everyone wanted or needed to be out of there at a certain time.
I had no idea what the situation was with the number 9 i was just having fun.
I was dq in the first race lost a second place for not going to tech because a guy was running around telling us to get out.
If i had known the situation on Sunday not only could i have stumped up for the protest but i could have written a check for the whole :censored: car and had a first place.
It is CLUB racing the SCCA do not have the time nor manpower to police us so we do it ourselves, Trust me there is a whole lot more to life than points and trophys.
Drive be safe and have fun, above all stay healthy.

09-03-2008, 08:14 PM
I'll atest to the lending of carbs, actually the trading of carbs. Patrick traded carbs with us when we were having issues Sat. AM and told us if it worked to give him our old carb and we would call it even. Well the car ran great and the throttle response was much improved. He even came over and tuned it for us. Since we were the only other competitor running against him and we were just running to sort out the new car, we didn't mind one bit about the heads. We actually learned that we need to buy a set :). Thats the most fun I've had driving in the rain and it was kind of cool to see 2 Asedan cars finish 1st and 2nd overall in front of a Porsche gt3r and a Corvette. (their cars are worth too much to risk driving fast in the rain at Sebring). Thanks for the carb Patrick.

Sean #40
09-04-2008, 05:11 PM
You know i qualified between a gt1 Corvette and a gt Porsche at Daytona, and we stayed in that position till the pace car came out and my car got hot so i slowed and let the Porsche by.
I think some of them do not want to break them in the dry either.